Payson Roundup

fred_franz (frederick franz) says…

“suggestion that fundraisers use the concept of socialism as a money harvesting tool.”

Socialists are the ones who increase your taxes for some worthy cause too. They are coming after your state sales tax in May.
-Fred

SantaBerry (Bernice Winandy) says…

Most people agree that health care reform is needed. What plan has the Republican Party put forth? Where can compromise be made so that the country can move forward?

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

As part of a fund-raising event the Republican National Committee referred to President Obama as a “Socialist.”

The result caused a big reaction in Washington and the RNC was evidently ready to back off a bit, but then came the grass roots reaction.

“I'm a member of the Republican National Committee and a pretty ordinary businessman, and I refer to what Democrats are doing as socialism,” says Curly Haugland of Bismarck, N.D.“This conversation is in the mainstream already; it's not just a public relations tool. It is a reflection of the exact feelings on the street.”

RNC member Donna Lou Gosney of West Virginia was also comfortable with the suggestion that fundraisers use the concept of socialism as a money harvesting tool.

“I'm so tired of this politically correct crap,” Gosney says. “If it's socialism, let's call it that. If not, let's call it something else.”

Somehow I find that hard to argue with, don't you?

SantaBerry (Bernice Winandy) says…

Tom, the country is deeply divided. The Republicans think about only what is good for them. The Democrats think only of what is good for them. No one thinks about what is good for the people. Where is compromise, where is sitting down, discussing, and giving the other guy something so that you can get something to the benefit of the whole country. I am truly disgusted with all the bickering, sniping, emotional appeals, unfounded rumors spreading like wildfire and thereby becoming “truth” to many and self interest of all.

We have a bunch of selfish infants in Washington.

patrandall (Pat Randall) says…

In a while all we will have is high tech machines for tests but no one to run them, or order the tests .
Many Dr.s have stopped taking Medicare, or any other insurances. AHCCCS is having a problem finding drs. for thier patients. Not that they care.
If you are on disabilty Medicare and AHCCCS you are already on the road to no health care.
Having to wait for them to decide if you need a dr. and what dr you will go to. Sometimes as long as three or four weeks before the decision then another month to get the appt.
How much worse can Obama make it?

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

“Most people agree that health care reform is needed.”

The operational word in that sentence is “reform.” The Obama socialized medicine bill now in Congress is not reform; it's replacement. It takes our current form of health care and replaces it with one which is entirely different, a government operated program paid for by taxes and controlled by bureaucrats. For this reason, even current liberal news media polls show that 76% of all Americans are opposed to it.

Since the Republicans are also opposed to it that puts them on the same side with the overwhelming majority of Americans where this issue is concerned. We should all, Democrat, Republican, and Independent alike get behind the Republican fight to kill the bill. That's what is called true compromise, putting aside party affiliations and supporting the people who are working desperately hard to prevent a tragedy.

Later, after the socialized medicine bill, with its 2900 pages of secret clauses has been killed, it will be time to talk about “sitting down and talking.” Not now. Not while the whole future of this nation hangs in the balance.

“How much worse can Obama make it?”

Pat, Take your beloved husband over to England for a few weeks. Then come back and tell us how much worse Obama can make it.

I've been there. I've seen it. Until you see socialized medicine with your own eyes you have no idea how bad can be. Trust me, it can be BAD bad. It can be bad enough so people sit on “eligibility lists” and die before they get operations which they would have within days or weeks in this country—even if they had no health insurance.

You can do what I did: Sit in a hospital waiting room and bleed out more than a pint of blood from a ripped open thumb, getting dizzier and dizzier watching a pool of your own blood spreading to a three foot diameter pool. You could get up and show the six people standing around doing nothing the pool of blood. You could listen to the reply from the nurse: “That's naught to worry about. We've someone to clean that up.”

You could go out to your car, bandage up your thumb with black tape and your own sock, drive 50 miles back to the base, finally get taken care of, and thank God your country doesn't have a garbage medical system like that.

That's how bad Obama can make it!!!!!!!!

patrandall (Pat Randall) says…

Tom,
Medicare and AHCCCS is govt. operated. Fed. and state.
A relative of mine had to have a stent placed placed between thier kidney and bladder, now has been waiting for about 3 weeks for AHCCCS to find a dr. that will do surgery. Has to be in Mesa because of past heart attack and being diabetic. No it can not be done here. To dangerous and to easy for complications. Even tho medicare takes care of the hospital bills AHCCCS has control over what dr. and hospital they go to.
Yes, I could pay for it but then they would lose what little benefits they get.
My 3yr.old great grandson sat in the ER here in Payson with a fish hook in his hand for over 3 hours. His dad finally took him home removed the hook and brought him back from Tonto Basin to the primary care Dr. the next day to see if he needed stitch's or any medicine. Had nothing to do with insurance. Too few ER drs. when there are a lot of emergencies. I consider a fish hook caught in a small childs hand an emergency, no matter who's kid it is.
Tom, we could argue from now on about health care. The way it is run and the medical profession in general.
I find it strange that Obama had a 1017 page health reform already written before he was elected and took office. Wish someone could explain that to me and how almost everyone can blame him alone for it.

SantaBerry (Bernice Winandy) says…

Tom, the Republicans have no health reform plan == they simply are against the Democrats == they don't care what happens as along as they get votes in the next election.

If the Republicans want to do something for the country, they should come up with a better, alternate plan and advertise it.

Frankly, the health care reform is going no where. We are wasting our time and energy talking about it.

Change is always difficult — most people afraid of change — the Republicans have made the most of this fear == without offering a plan of their own.

rtnaz (Rex Hinshaw) says…

Bernice ,
Your statements about Republicans are untrue . They are for healthcare REFORM….they are against the Democrats' healthcare government takeover and nationalzation.
They support an incremental process of reform including : tort reform , portability of insurance policies , and non-denial based on prior conditions ,to mention a few.
The Republicans have been trying to get their plans out , but it is difficult with the mainstream liberal media bias.
If the Democrats really cared about the citizens of this country , and what they wanted , they would stop this attemt to take over one 6th of the U.S. economy and concentrate on jobs.

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

“Tom, the Republicans have no health reform plan…”

Bernice, it troubles me to see you repeating statements which are so demonstrably untrue. If there are no Republican ideas, how can this article (which is only one of hundreds which say exactly the same thing) be true?

Tue Mar 2, 6:32 pm ET.

washington – President Barack Obama embraced a handful of Republican health care ideas Tuesday to lure Democratic votes as he prepared to spell out his final package for a sharply divided House and Senate.

In a letter to congressional leaders Tuesday, Obama said he would consider four ideas floated by Republican lawmakers: sending investigators disguised as patients to uncover fraud and waste in Medicare and Medicaid; expanding pilot programs to bring more predictability to medical malpractice lawsuits; increasing payments to Medicaid providers; and expanding the use of health savings accounts.
“I said throughout this process that I'd continue to draw on the best ideas from both parties, and I'm open to these proposals in that spirit,” Obama wrote.
In a nod to his 2008 presidential rival, he said he had eliminated a special deal for Medicare Advantage beneficiaries in Florida and other states that drew criticism from Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz.
But Obama again rejected Republican appeals to restart the health care debate or dramatically scale back his proposals.
“Piecemeal reform is not the best way to effectively reduce premiums, end the exclusion of people with pre-existing conditions or offer Americans the security of knowing that they will never lose coverage,” his letter said.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi said the letter “brings us just another step closer to passing the bill.” She said she hopes to incorporate some of the GOP ideas.
––––-
If you have been listening to the news lately you have heard your TV news program, regardless of which one it is, making the same statement.

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

Here's some more for you, Bernice:

“If the Republicans want to do something for the country, they should come up with a better, alternate plan and advertise it.”

Okay, fair enough. Go to this site and see the better, alternate plan advertised by the Republicans at the moment.

http://www.gop.gov/solutions/healthcare

Here's just a wee bit of it. I challenge you to show me anything wrong with these ideas:

“Republican Leader John Boehner (R-OH) discussed Republicans’ plan for common-sense health care reform our nation can afford.  Boehner’s address emphasized four common-sense reforms that will lower health care costs and expand access to quality care without a government takeover of our nation’s health care system that kills jobs, raises taxes on small businesses, or cuts Medicare for seniors:
• Number one: let families and businesses buy health insurance across state lines.
• Number two: allow individuals, small businesses, and trade associations to pool together and acquire health insurance at lower prices, the same way large corporations and labor unions do.
• Number three: give states the tools to create their own innovative reforms that lower health care costs.
• Number four: end junk lawsuits that contribute to higher health care costs by increasing the number of tests and procedures that physicians sometimes order not because they think it's good medicine, but because they are afraid of being sued.”
––––
Here are common-sense health care reforms proposed by Republicans, please visit the links below:

• Empowering Patients First Act  (Republican Study Committee  Health Care Reform Bill, introduced July 30, 2009)
• Improving Health Care for All Americans Act (Shadegg Health Care Reform Bill, introduced July 14, 2009)
• Medical Rights & Reform Act   (Kirk-Dent Health Care  Reform Bill, introduced June 16, 2009)
• Help Efficient, Accessible, Low-cost, Timely Healthcare (health) Act   (Gingrey medical liability reform bill, introduced June 6, 2009)  
• Small Business Health Fairness Act of 2009   (Johnson small business health plans bill, introduced May 21, 2009)
• Promoting Health and Preventing Chronic Disease through  Prevention and Wellness Programs for Employees, Communities, and Individuals Act of 2009   (Castle Wellness & Prevention Bill, introduced July 31, 2009)
• Improved Employee Access to Health Insurance Act of 2009  (Deal auto-enrollment bill, introduced October 15, 2009)
• Health Insurance Access for Young Workers and College Students Act of 2009  (Blunt bill to improve health insurance coverage of dependents, introduced October 21, 2009)

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

If that isn't enough to convince you that you have been duped in to beliveing a mistruth, don;t take my word for it. Just go to Google and type in “Republican health care plans.” Here's what you will get:

“Results 1 - 10 of about 12,500,000 for republican health care plans”

I don't know if you want to read all 12 million results, but if you read—say—just ten of them you'll see how false are the claims of Pelosi et al that the Republicans offer no alternatives.

patrandall (Pat Randall) says…

Tom,
Did you read the orginal 1017 pages of the health plan?
If not, how can you compare the plans?

patrandall (Pat Randall) says…

Tom,
I tried to go onto the site and it said. Unable to open the internet site. Operation aborted.
Is it my computer or has it been removed?

SantaBerry (Bernice Winandy) says…

Tom, how much of what the Republicans propose is in the Democrat's plan? I see a lot of negativism on the part of Republicans. It is easy to criticize and they have been doing that from day one. Their appeal has been to the emotions — death panels, etc.

I want health reform. If they have a plan they should get it out there and stop mudding the waters with appeals to the emotions.

They should sit down and work something out. Right now I just see posturing for getting votes in November==by both parties.

SantaBerry (Bernice Winandy) says…

The Republicans can get their message out about their health plan and are not prevented from doing so by a “biased press.” Afterall, they got their message out about death panels, Obama's disputed citizenship, etc. They should tell which points they agree with in the proposed health plan and the points they disagree with. They should then in a rational manner (not appeal to the emotions) explain why they disagree with those points and offer sound alternatives and explain why their plan is better. If they did that they would be serving the country and not their self interests. If the Democrats explained why they were opposed to the Republican version, then the Democrats would also be serving the country rather than their own self interests. The discussion of health care reform should not be argued in “sound bites.”

Health care reform is needed. By bickering and trying to get a larger piece of the pie each party is doing the country a disservice. I will say no more on this subject.

Tom_Garrett (Tom Garrett) says…

“Tom, how much of what the Republicans propose is in the Democrat's plan?”

None of it. Obama's plan does not have “reform” as its goal. It's goal it to replace what we have with Socialized Medicine. Putting things in his bill which would truly reform out system would be counterproductive since it would eliminate complaints which he uses to muddy the waters.

“It is easy to criticize and they have been doing that from day one.”

Sure it's easy to criticize. Are you a Socialist? If not, then why aren't you criticizing a program which will totally eliminate private medicine?

“If they have a plan they should get it out there…”

Did you read my post? I'll repeat part of it. Every one of these is a bill placed in the hopper by Republicans. Isn't that how they are supposed to “get it out there?”

• Empowering Patients First Act (Republican Study Committee Health Care Reform Bill, introduced July 30, 2009)
• Improving Health Care for All Americans Act (Shadegg Health Care Reform Bill, introduced July 14, 2009)
• Medical Rights & Reform Act (Kirk-Dent Health Care Reform Bill, introduced June 16, 2009)
• Help Efficient, Accessible, Low-cost, Timely Healthcare (health) Act (Gingrey medical liability reform bill, introduced June 6, 2009)
• Small Business Health Fairness Act of 2009 (Johnson small business health plans bill, introduced May 21, 2009)
• Promoting Health and Preventing Chronic Disease through Prevention and Wellness Programs for Employees, Communities, and Individuals Act of 2009 (Castle Wellness & Prevention Bill, introduced July 31, 2009)
• Improved Employee Access to Health Insurance Act of 2009 (Deal auto-enrollment bill, introduced October 15, 2009)
• Health Insurance Access for Young Workers and College Students Act of 2009 (Blunt bill to improve health insurance coverage of dependents, introduced October 21, 2009)

The difference between these bills and the Obamacare bill is that they were not written behind closed doors. If you click on the URL I posted you can actually go there and read them. Try it. It'll turn you around 180 degrees. I'm not kidding. These are things you would love to see happen. For one thing, since you live up here in a rural area the bill that would allow health care insurance to be sold across state borders would cut the cost of your insurance by as much as 80% depending on what you have now. Is that something you would like to see? Why isn't it in Obama's plan?

“The Republicans can get their message out about their health plan and are not prevented from doing so by a “biased press.””

How many of the bills I just mentioned have you heard carried on the news?

Be honest, Bernice. If it were in your power to approve the current health care bill would you do it?