Thursday December 5, 2013
Jump to content
Tom: more on the topic including a few other studies and brief interviews with long-term, recreational runners. You might also want to pick up "Born to Run" and read that. It has a lot of research on anatomy and running. It's bottom line is obvious from the title -- we are born to run long distances
Sorry, Tom, but it is a myth that running "as a long-term method of exercise ... comes with some great drawbacks where knees and hips are concerned."
The research does not support that, except possibly (and that one is up in the air) for elite-level runners who maintain a very high-volume, high-intensity training program over many years.
But long-distance running, in the proper shoes, may actually be beneficial to the hips and knees. Staying off of concrete makes a big difference, too.
The research, at least that which I've come across, shows there certainly is no evidence that runners are at a statistically greater risk of osteoarthritis than non-runners.
As for the trail-sharing in town, I understand what you're saying about a possible conflict there -- in theory. I doubt anybody who rides bikes would care much if those stretches of trail (and sidewalks) were designated as off limits for mountain bikes. As far as that goes, I think I've said here before that I don't think bikes belong on sidewalks at all. It's a hazard for the bike rider, especially going against traffic.
But in practice, at least on the actual "trail" sections, I don't think it's an issue.
I run on the trails within town, too. (And on the streets). In fact, my home is about 400 feet from a "trailhead." I have yet to encounter a mountain bike on a trail in town.
I have seen some riders around town on the streets, and often coming up Doll Baby Ranch near the golf course after riding, I assume, on Peach Orchard road and loop or somewhere else out off of Doll Baby Ranch. When I ride my mountain bike, I just go out on forest roads and ride.
Riders evidently don't use the "trails," such as they are, within town. Heck, I don't even run on some stretches of the in-town trail because they're often overgrown with weeds.
Now, as for the college campus in Payson.... I've been in a lot of college towns, and I think they are some of the greatest places I've been. They tend to be economically strong with a diverse population.
Yes, there will be changes. I believe those changes will be beneficial far more often than they will be a drawback. I'd say it sure beats the alternative, which is to live in a town or city where the economic engine has died.
Just to weigh in on the original topic here and leave the college campus for another day, I really see no problem with bikers and hikers sharing trails in this area. I have run and hike and ridden a mountain bike in and around this whole area and I almost never encounter anybody on foot or bike.
It's hard to imagine that the trails are suddenly going to become overcrowded.
Further, Tom I think most of the examples of mountain biking that you cited refer to downhill mountain biking, which is more of an extreme sport than what is typical "cross-country" mountain biking.
The downhillers stick to ski-resort towns in the offseason for the most part. Most riders are on cross-country bikes and ride at a leisurely pace. Even when they're trying to go fast, they're really not going to be able to in most instances.
With all that said, I also do a lot of running and hiking at South Mountain and at McDowell Mountain Park in the Valley. There are hundreds of mountain bikers and hikers and runners all over the place out there. Horses, too, although I've only encounter those riders at McDowell Mountain.
I have run several times in the White Tanks Mountains, at Pass Mountain (east Mesa) and Elephant Mountain (north Valley).
I've never had a single problem with anybody. Not once.
Hikers and bikers alike tend to be polite people and usually give way if the trail is tight. If I'm going downhill, I always let the guy coming up go because it's harder (on a bike anyway) to get going again going uphill than down.
I always say thanks when somebody yields to me. I always say, "have a good run" or "have a good ride" after we pass, whether I yield or the other person or persons yields to me.
Oil and water may not mix. Payson and a college campus may not either, though I tend to say that they'll mix just fine there.
But mountain bikers and hikers get along just fine, at least in my experience.
I'd be interested to know what Mick, who owns Bicycle Adventures (formerly Hike, Bike and Run) thinks about the topic. He has far more mountain-biking and hiking experience than any of us.
The drug stuff is urban myth. I recall seeing a story not that long ago from Tucson, in which a police spokesman said that there is no correlation. Shoes show up in drug areas. They show up in areas where there are no drugs. Here's another item on it.
Hey, they can use a couple hundred gallons of that water to put out "stove" fires...
I checked in on this case just out of curiosity. Both defendants entered guilty pleas in exchange for having other charges dropped. The woman, Desiree David, entered a guilty plea to aggravated DUI/Suspended license. In exchange, two child endangerment charges were dropped.
The male defendant, Alex Landry, pleaded guilty to contributing to the delinquency of a minor. I'm not sure how they arrived at that, but there it is in the records.
As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the woman has a rather lengthy history of this stuff and had just gotten out of jail. She'll be sentenced in June, and I hope this time she stays in jail for a very long time.
The cop made a good arrest and two bad people were convicted.
As for the kids, man, I feel sorry for them.
This horrible day in Connecticut will prime the gun debate, but a troubled mind will find a way with or without a gun.
Yesterday's shooting was not the largest mass killing at a U.S. school. That happened in 1927, the Bath School Massacre. Google it. The killer used a gun for only one purpose, and that was to detonate a car bomb in his car. He tried to destroy an entire school with bombs, and very nearly succeeded. In many ways, it mirrors what happened in Connecticut. His day started with him killing his wife rather than his mother. Most of his victims were in 7 to 11 years old.
Pat, it happened in Cave Creek. Tom, the parents have no money. They're indigent. She was released from Perryville in March. They've be convicted and they'll go to jail.
Well Tom, I guess we'll find out soon enough as a Maricopa County grand jury handed down felony indictments on both defendants Nov. 1.
As I mentioned above, they were not charged with DUI. However, each was charged with two counts under the child or vulnerable adult abuse statute (13-3623), with recklessness and therefore a Class 5 Felony prior to the indictment.
The mother has been charged three times in the past for DUI, and most recently entered a guilty plea on aggravated DUI and driving on a suspended or revoked license. A petition for revocation of her probation was filed not long after her arrest in Cave Creek.
If I get a chance, I'll drop by the courthouse and request the records. I'm curious to read exactly what the police report says.
Should the cops have waited for this idiot to take control of the car? I don't think so. And I'll bet you lunch they get a conviction or a guilty plea (again).
By the way, I find that you and I almost always agree on things. It just takes us awhile to figure out why.
By the way, they were charged with child abuse and endangerment, not DUI... Leaving 3 and 4 year old kids in a car at 11-11:30 p.m. while you're inside boozing sounds like abuse and endangerment to me. And, again, there is nothing that I see in any report about the car being locked.
Last login: Monday, September 23, 2013